OPB--
I'm sorry, was there a debate? Dang! Missed another one.
Sleepy Ted Kulongoski who is famous for not doing anything in Oregon and publicly commenting that he does not have time for debates held true to his word on March 13, 2006 when six of the seven major candidates for governor met Monday to debate in Salem without the governor.
The debate, sponsored by the Associated Press Newspaper Executives at Willamette University
Oregonian reporter Harry Esteve read a question from the audience...
" Should we as a community provide education to the children of illegal immigrants?"
The response from the candidates were…
Ben Westlund: "Absolutely. I'm trying to save time there. No ifs, no ands, no discussion. Without question."
Pete Sorenson: "Oregon's constitution provides for free public education [with our tax dollars] for anyone in our state. I favor that and beyond that I also favor a ballot measure that would make health care an equal right."
Ron Saxton: "This is about meeting the needs of our citizens. This is about honoring and respecting those who are here legally. When we have a society that draws no distinctions between people who are here legally and people who are here illegally, we make a mockery of those who have complied with the law, those who have come into the system legally."
Kevin Mannix: "This question was about children. This wasn't about adults. As adults we don't want to give taxpayer subsidy and encouragement to folks to be here illegally. But do you say that to a child? Where do we draw the line? If you saw someone bleeding in the center of the road, would you run out there and say show me you identity card before I render assistance." that is a cold heartless comparison. The point is about illegal immigration, not being a cold heartless person. (See my comment below about children)
Jim Hill: "It's wrong and immoral to talk about not giving children services. When people are born in this country, I think they're Americans and they have all the rights that Americans should have and all the privileges that Americans should have."
Jason Atkinson: "The problem is that children who are here, whose parents were illegal immigrants, are typically citizens of the United States of America. And so are we going to deny someone and education because of the color of their skin? The answer certainly is not."
Jason Atkinson makes an excellent point.
One of the claims for people coming here illegally is to make a better lives for themselves... but what about their children?
I recall a story where this young girl tried to enter college after high school and the college asked her for her immigration papers and when she asked her parents for the documents, is when she found out that her parents entered the country illegally when she was very young.
Imagine the dilemma that this child has been placed into. If I was in a similar situation, I would be devastated.
So the debate is, did the parents actually do the child a favor by bringing her over here illegally or were the motives totally selfish?
As far as Jason Atkinson statement, "... are we going to deny someone education because of the color of their skin?"
I agree with Jason that the color of one's skin should not be a factor for education, however, I do feel that legality should be a factor on who PAYS for that child's education.
It is not uncommon for other countries to send their children to the United States for education. However, they are normally picking up the tab for that education, not the taxpayers.
8 comments:
For the most part I agree with what you say about immigration, but when I read your comments, "One of the claims for people coming here illegally is to make a better lives for themselves..." I really feel frustration and confusion about how you can excuse illegal immigration simply because these people want to make a better life for themselves. There already exist methods for entering this country legally that allow people in unfavorable situations to make better lives for themselves. When people enter this country illegallly they cannot expect to have the rights and priviledges of citizens or those immigrants who have entered the country legally. The parents of this girl you talk of have already done their child a disservice by coming here illegally and based on that crucial choice it's quite clear that their motives were selfish. They thought only of themselves and not of what consequences their actions would mean, otherwise they would have opted to come the the USA legally. Additionally, the comments you quote from Jason Atkinson, "... are we going to deny someone education because of the color of their skin?" are appalling and sound like left-wing-propaganda. Atkinson has missed the point entirely and I'm disapointed to see how off-base he is. The issue here has nothing to do with race or skin color and everything to do with legal immigration. To bring race into the debate does nothing but muddy the waters of what should be a clearly defined issue.
Robin, while I agree with you on so many issues, this is one that is so crucial to the illegal invasion that I hope you reconsider.
I was really excited about Jason but it appears that he doesn't have the conviction on this issue that I ask for. Ron Saxon is looking better all the time. He is the only one who has a handle on this.
We need to change the constitution so that children born here of even one illegal are not concidered citizens.
Please don't help reward bad behavior by championing this emotional aspect that is used to further the amnesty agenda. Bob
Please see my blog for a recent post on the very issue of education for illegal aliens. Saxton basically wants to violate the rule of the Supreme Court. Atkinson makes points that sound quite similar to the Court's opinion.
Saxton's position is wrong, and he should know it. He's pandering to obtain votes.
While there are many legal steps that a governor can take to render illegal status less pleasant in the state, denial of education to children is not among them.
Now - is it necessary to supply them with more expensive ESL classes as opposed to English immersion classes? I don't think so - and that is one of the options available to a governor.
Oregon chooses to implement a much more expensive - and demonstrably less effective approach. The right governor can change that.
I love it when people pull out the color card or for that matter the religion card. let me shout this at you - ILLEGAL IS ILLEGAL NO MATTER WHAT YOU LABEL IT. AND WHEN DID IMMIGRANT INSTANTLY MEAN A PERSON OF COLOR? I feel sorry for the children that are caught up in the mess, but did it occur to anyone that the parents KNEW what they were doing? Perhaps they expected the US would take care of the child, even if the adult was an illegal. Heck of a way to get a better life for your children. Most of us work for it. I quite frankly am tired of my tax dollars paying for crime. If it isn't being used to support ciminals in prison, or war, it's being given away to illegal folks who came to this country with nothing. This includes Social Security benefits paid to people who have never worked a job in this country.
Let me say it one more time -NO MATTER WHAT YOU LABEL IT - ILLEGAL IS ILLEGAL!
Groups that support illegal aliens getting services paid for by the taxes of Americans will often use children to get what they want. I would be totally against children of illegal aliens getting free education on our nickel.
Mothers often will try and be in our country right when they give birth - the old "anchor baby" flaw in USA law. (should be removed)
It has nothing to do with color or race, but everything to do with what is legal or illegal.
I'm a little disappointed than Jason tried to equate an issue of legal or illegal with some guilt trip - like people against illegal aliens are racist or something. Jason, it's nothing to do with race like you want to make it out to be - it has all to do with legal vs. illegal.
Anthony and Tammy, you are delusional on this.
Jason Atkinson consistently injects race into this debate with his "brown skin" comment. That is racist. I have brown skin. He doesn't speak for me and isn't helping the debate.
This isn't about skin color. I don't care if we had illegals from Sweden. Send them back!
Only liberals think in terms of skin color and automatically bring their answers there without being prompted. The question wasn't about skin color, it was about educating the children of illegals. And he had a great answer until he started talking about skin color again.
He says that he doesn't want to live in a state that rounds up everyone with "brown skin." That tells me that he is thinking about "perception of racism." Which tells me that when he is actually rounding up illegals, and is called racist, he will worry about that perception. And he will stop sending illegals home, if he ever started.
Sorry, but Atkinson wants too much to please the middle and the left in order to make friends.
-Andy
I cannot believe that Atkinson will be chosen to run in November because he supports the President's "Guest Worker" program. That program equates to amnesty for the illegals and that is wrong, and that will defeat Atkinson in the primaries. Saxton may not be the ideal candidate for governor, but he does not support amnesty for the illegals in the form of "Guest Worker" status.
Max said that Saxton is pandering for votes. All politicians pander for votes. It is in their nature. I almost believe that there is something in their DNA that makes pandering come naturally.
Teddy the K said that he will show up at the next two debates. Sure he will. But don't hold your collective breaths. I'll believe that when I actually see him walk onto the stage. He hasn't done a single thing for the voters of Oregon since he was elected except to show up for the funerals of the fallen soldiers. That is probably only because he is an ex-Marine and feels it is his duty. One cannot describe him as a former Marine, but only as an ex-Marine. And there is a definite difference. Just ask any Marine combat veteran.
I am getting sidetracked, here.
All this boils down into the fact that Teddy the K will not be in the running next November. His own sorry showing as governor of Oregon will take care of that issue. After Teddy the K is given the boot, next on the Oregon voters agendas has to be to give the badly needed boot to Guillermo Bradbury and, of course, Anne Marten.
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